Comments on: Ob-Ugric, II http://www.fridaycircle.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/ Hungarian Studies in London Wed, 12 May 2010 09:18:33 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Ob-Ugric, III ‹ The Friday Circle http://www.fridaycircle.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-137 Ob-Ugric, III ‹ The Friday Circle Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:50:43 +0000 http://fridaycircle.wordpress.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/#comment-137 [...] of all, here’s the ending to last week’s mouse story: ań ta śuńēɣt, ań ta χūleɣt. ta [...] [...] of all, here’s the ending to last week’s mouse story: ań ta śuńēɣt, ań ta χūleɣt. ta [...]

]]> By: Friday Circle http://www.fridaycircle.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-45 Friday Circle Tue, 22 Apr 2008 18:26:54 +0000 http://fridaycircle.wordpress.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/#comment-45 You're absolutely right, apologies, my transcription of the class was inaccurate: šiŋire is not Mansi, and while we did segment mātāpriś as mā+tāp+riś, the -tāp- as bear bile had a couple of large question marks hanging overhead. All errors describing semantic analysis are my own, not those of the teacher! Many thanks for your comment. You’re absolutely right, apologies, my transcription of the class was inaccurate: šiŋire is not Mansi, and while we did segment mātāpriś as mā+tāp+riś, the -tāp- as bear bile had a couple of large question marks hanging overhead. All errors describing semantic analysis are my own, not those of the teacher!

Many thanks for your comment.

]]> By: mātāpriś http://www.fridaycircle.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-46 mātāpriś Sat, 12 Apr 2008 09:05:25 +0000 http://fridaycircle.wordpress.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/#comment-46 šiŋire (more probably šiŋere) is not a Mansi word but the Proto-Finno-Ugric form of Modern Hungarian egér. In the 19-20th century Mansi dialects it had forms täŋkär / täŋkər etc. (see A magyar szókészlet finnugor elemeiI. A-Gy, Akadémiai, Budapest, 1967, 140). The right segmentation of mātāpriś is mā+tāp+riś . Although tāp really means 'bear’s gallbladder (or bile)' (see Munkácsi--Kálmán: Wogulishes Wörterbuch, Akadémiai, Budapest, 1986, 627), I am not sure this can be the source of -tāp- in mātāpriś. (If I had to say something at this moment I would say that it probably comes from the täŋkär-forms and it originally means 'earth mouse' [or 'mole', which is the other meaning of mātāpriś]. However, this idea is a bit problematic from the phonetic point of view: ŋk > p is not a typical change in Mansi, as far as I know.) Do you have any etymological source that states that -tāp- in mātāpriś comes from tāp 'bear bile'? Anyhow, I am very happy to see that there are people who are interested in these things and at least a part of The Tale of the Mouse can be read on the internet in English. Enjoy Your work, have fun! šiŋire (more probably šiŋere) is not a Mansi word but the Proto-Finno-Ugric form of Modern Hungarian egér. In the 19-20th century Mansi dialects it had forms täŋkär / täŋkər etc. (see A magyar szókészlet finnugor elemeiI. A-Gy, Akadémiai, Budapest, 1967, 140).

The right segmentation of mātāpriś is mā+tāp+riś . Although tāp really means ‘bear’s gallbladder (or bile)’ (see Munkácsi–Kálmán: Wogulishes Wörterbuch, Akadémiai, Budapest, 1986, 627), I am not sure this can be the source of -tāp- in mātāpriś. (If I had to say something at this moment I would say that it probably comes from the täŋkär-forms and it originally means ‘earth mouse’ [or 'mole', which is the other meaning of mātāpriś]. However, this idea is a bit problematic from the phonetic point of view: ŋk > p is not a typical change in Mansi, as far as I know.) Do you have any etymological source that states that -tāp- in mātāpriś comes from tāp ‘bear bile’?

Anyhow, I am very happy to see that there are people who are interested in these things and at least a part of The Tale of the Mouse can be read on the internet in English.

Enjoy Your work, have fun!

]]> By: Ob-Ugric X - Pim « The Friday Circle http://www.fridaycircle.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-44 Ob-Ugric X - Pim « The Friday Circle Sat, 22 Mar 2008 16:34:41 +0000 http://fridaycircle.wordpress.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/#comment-44 [...] in the story of the mouse, the object becomes seen to the viewer. The women return home to cook, and put death-cap mushrooms [...] [...] in the story of the mouse, the object becomes seen to the viewer. The women return home to cook, and put death-cap mushrooms [...]

]]> By: Ob-Ugric, III « The Friday Circle http://www.fridaycircle.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/comment-page-1/#comment-43 Ob-Ugric, III « The Friday Circle Sun, 18 Feb 2007 10:57:54 +0000 http://fridaycircle.wordpress.com/2007/01/19/ob-ugric-ii/#comment-43 [...] 29, 2007 Posted by fridaycircle in Ob-Ugric. trackback First of all, here’s the ending to last week’s mouse story: ań ta śuńēɣt, ań ta χūleɣt. ta [...] [...] 29, 2007 Posted by fridaycircle in Ob-Ugric. trackback First of all, here’s the ending to last week’s mouse story: ań ta śuńēɣt, ań ta χūleɣt. ta [...]

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